Red herring or clue? Or just me, woolgathering?

[amanuensis1]

Just finished transcribing the first draft of my second Pornish Pixies Fantasy Fest fic. (Wrote most of it out longhand over the weekend. Yes, it's VERY nice to have the computer back.) You know what I discovered, researching part of it?

Harry can tell Fred and George apart.

No, I mean, canonically, really, he can. These are twins who are identical enough to fool their own mother, and from the moment Harry hears Fred say, "Only joking, I am Fred," he never mixes them up. When they show up in the books, there are no, "Fred--or George, Harry couldn't tell which--said," moments. It's all "said Fred," "said George," without any identifying moments pointed out or spoken to Harry. And I'm betting it has nothing to do with the Weasley jumpers--they can't coincidentally have those things on in every scene they're in with Harry. JKR'd have said that, the first time Harry has a scene with them.

Anybody think this means something?

Comments

[boniblithe.livejournal.com]

It means he pays attention to detail.

Or, it means he has a mad crush on one of them.

[dragonessasmith.livejournal.com]

*coughcoughGEORGEcoughcough*

[here-be-dragons.livejournal.com]

(Here via daily_snitch, btw)

Except that I perceive Harry as someone who most definitely does *not* pay attention to detail. Not all the time, anyway. The biggest "proof" for me being the CoMC class in OoP where we learn that Harry doesn't even know the *name* of the "stringy" Slytherin boy. HUH? He's been in class with that kid for at least more than two years (in CoMC, anyway), and has probably had potions with him for more than four years.

So, Harry doesn't strike me as the most observant of fellows. Which would mean that there is some other reason he's able to tell them apart. I don't have a theory about it, though.

[boniblithe.livejournal.com]

He's observant about things he cares about. He does have tunnel vision, but he knows all kinds of Qudditch broom details :) So he cares about Fred and George, he doesn't care about the stringy Slytherin kid.

[dphearson.livejournal.com]

But a lot of school friends can tell their twin friends apart. I could tell two sets of twins apart that went to my academy when I was little.And I when I taught, I could tell twins apart as well. There was a rythym of speech and a expression of face that seemed unique to me.
Which brings me to Harry. Harry sees people as they are presented to him- another clue, perhaps, about having Lily's eyes? Perhaps she was able to see people as they are, withthe worse and best inside of them. So does Harry, bless him.

[jacquez.livejournal.com]

Yeah - and my identical twin brothers don't look anything alike to me. But F&G are close enough in looks that _their own mother_ can't tell them apart, which...my mom can certainly tell my brothers apart, and so can the mothers of all the identical twins I know.

So I assume that F&G are supposed to look much more alike than your average identical twins.

[icarusancalion.livejournal.com]

But that's Molly, and in her more scattered, harried moments. I have the feeling that Molly's the sort that on a bad day might have dressed Ron in Ginny's clothes, and Ginny in Ron's.

Icarus

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

I would lean more towards this reply; the fact that he can tell them apart doesn't say something about Harry so much as it's a ... I guess "jab" is too firm of a word. It's a comment on Molly.

[horsefacehannah.livejournal.com]

Actually, she can tell them apart. They just like to mess with her mind.

[dudski.livejournal.com]

Agreed. The only time I remember Molly getting them wrong was in King's Cross, and she had it right the first time. She apologized when the twins said she was wrong, but considering how frazzled she must have been at that point (we've seen how chaotic things are on September first), she either didn't think to doubt them or just wanted to shut them up.

[aeslis]

i must say, i knew four sets of twins in my high school years. one set was easy to tell apart from the beginning, one set after knowing them for about a week, and two sets i could NEVER tell apart. i really think it depends on the twins.

[delfeus.livejournal.com]

My ex had a twin. They weren't even identical, but looked very similar. I had a friend who had gone to school with them for at least 4 years and she could only tell them apart by their shoes!

[koneko-meow.livejournal.com]

Um....it proves that theirloveissocanon? I don't know....I never really noticed it, very interesting though.

[jolie-reader.livejournal.com]

It could just be that JKR kept it straight in her own head and didn't notice that Harry shouldn't be able to. But it would be really cool if it was something more. *roots for that*

[slinkhard.livejournal.com]

I've gotta agree, I think it's just an authorial mistake...

[vileseagulls.livejournal.com]

I noticed something else - it's nearly always Fred who speaks first, who tells people the plans, and so forth. At least in books two and three - I haven't read the others since I noticed that.

[switchknife.livejournal.com]

You're right, George is the quieter one. I <3 my George.

[vileseagulls.livejournal.com]

Whoo! I'm not out of my mind. :D

[icarusancalion.livejournal.com]

Yes! Exactly. I've noticed that, too.

Icarus

[gmth.livejournal.com]

Wait a second... I think you're onto something here. Fred and George are Lee Jordan's best friends, after all, so maybe Steve was actually RIGHT.

[switchknife.livejournal.com]

Threesome smut!

*grins cheerfully*

[sm-malfoys.livejournal.com]

Bunny. Can he tell them apart blindfolded *poke*

[icarusancalion.livejournal.com]

Harry is the quiet, observant type.

In my experience, twins look alike superficially, but they can easily be told apart because their personalities are different. One will be "the follower," or be gentler, or have that wide-eyed expression.

I've had twins write to me about my Fred and George, and what they're grateful for is that I write the two as very different people. I think that Harry's just noticed that from the beginning.

Icarus

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

*nods* There's an answer that rings true above all. Observant Harry.

[hilarityallen.livejournal.com]

It's probably not odd that Harry would learn to recognise Fred and George, or that Molly (in moments of stress) would get them mixed up. What is probably more unusual is that Harry seems to recognise them pretty much straight away. Either theirloveissocanon (which at 11 I'd really hope wasn't the case) or Harry is indeed very observant.

Hilarita

[jeddy83.livejournal.com]

Mmm, maybe they are magically labelled in some way while at school to prevent chaos.

[stanharding.livejournal.com]

Not to burst bubbles, but I suspect that Rowling (a) did the Mom can't tell Fred/George apart to be funny and to establish that they're identical twins, since it's where we first meet them (has she ever done it again?), and (b) she hasn't done it with Harry because it would interfere with whatever she's focusing on in that scene. In other words, no plan.

Actually, I think that's true for a lot of HP universe details that people tend to obsess over - she put them in not because they have significance, but because she had this cool idea and she coud.

Icon love!

[fangwen.livejournal.com]

Hell, I'm years older than my sister and we look absolutely nothing alike, and my parents STILL call us by each others' names. :)

Re: Icon love!

[ex-thewayout304.livejournal.com]

Yes, but I don't think that has anything to do with not being able to tell you two apart. I think it is more forgetfulness/absentmindedness/distraction than anything else. Hell, sometimes my mom calls me by my brother's name if she's in a particularly irksome mood. It doesn't mean she can't tell us apart, it just means she's mad and not thinking straight.

Re: Icon love!

[stanharding.livejournal.com]

OMG, R U in Sprklipu 2? KEEWL! OMG!1!

Re: Icon love!

[(Anonymous)]

My grandma does this too, only she has 8 kids to go through, and usually goes through the entire list before she gets the right name.

[ex-thewayout304.livejournal.com]

I think you're right. Also, that one time she "mixed them up", she had actually gotten it right. The twins were playing a joke on her. I don't think she really gets them mixed up at all, but in the state of confusion at the train station, she was willing to believe that she did.

[glockgal.livejournal.com]

It means OT3!!!!!!!!

Aieeeee! *runs around in gleeful circles before slamming into a pole*

[loony-moony.livejournal.com]

*pets the bruised Glock and seconds on that wonderful OT3 possibility, just for the fun of it >:D*

here via daily_snitch

[paracaidas.livejournal.com]

How curious! I never noticed that. Obviously Harry is in love with at least one of them! Oh how darling that would be! :)

[hellocalamity.livejournal.com]

My mother calls me and my sister by each others' names so much that I respond to Emma as well as my own name. Not only are we not twins, but there really is no difficulty involved in discerning between your 17-year-old and your 10-year-old daughter. She does it whenever she's distracted or stressed. Once, she was trying to call my brother to dinner, and she kept yelling our dog's name.

My mother as an example is a little extreme, but I feel I've made my point. Mixing up names is not that unusual, and I'd bet Molly does the same as my mum, maybe even with her children besides the twins. I'd blame it on stress; I'm sure each twin has different mannerisms that help to distinguish between the two.

[apathyandgenius.livejournal.com]

I had actually noticed that everyone seemed to be able to tell the twins apart, no problem. However, I'm not opposed to some lovely threesome slash every once in a while. :) By the way, I'm the lurker, who reads tons of fanfics and is too lazy to actually write any. I added you if that's alright.
~Libs

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

Thanks for the comments! And lurkage or friendage or whatever is always delightful. ^_^

[leni-jess.livejournal.com]

I'm trying at the moment to finish a belated CCC fic with the twins, where being able to distinguish between them is important. It seems to me, from canon, that it must be a matter of mannerism and revealed personality (dominant twin!Fred stuff), rather than physical differences, though I believe that after five or more years as beaters in the Quidditch team they could have someidentifiying scars.

Certainly their utterances in canon (where they're not doing the comic turn echo/finishing sentences) do seem to differentiate them. I agree Molly's inability to distinguish, under stress and misled by her rotten offspring, would be temporary. On the other hand, you can bet they've spent a lot of time trying to fox her, and anyone else, for fun, for malice, on principle, and as serious practice. Probably, too, Molly isn't paying all that much attention, half the time - she knows perfectly well they like to play that game, and can think of better things to do with her perceptions.

As for Harry being able to tell the difference - I do think that's a miracle. Maybe he just happened to notice, one time, and that was enough.

[missfaith.livejournal.com]

Hmmm...

1) Maybe it would just be too damn annoying to litter the books with novelty twin mix up scenarios, it's not a funny joke and doesn't really help the plot, so why bother?

2) Harry has never had any friends or proper family, it seems logical (to me, at least!) that he would pay attention to everyone around him then, especially when he starts to feel welcomed by them.

Im sure most people have experienced the frustration of having a conversation, remembering most of it, then having the other person forget they ever met you. Let alone that you found you were both in the same school class 15 years ago, etc. Maybe Harry is just one of those observant types, after all, he spent most of his childhood listening/watching quietly.

3) Molly is scatty, she can tell them apart, she's just scatty, like many other responders i get called by my brothers/dogs name often, but im pretty sure my parents can distinguish between me and my spaniel!

[cyanei.livejournal.com]

Hrm, I would say it shows that Harry cares enough to tell them apart. You don't need to be mega-observant to identfy twins. (Especially in my case, since I have a twin brother. Boobs are a helpful thing. ( ; )

There's also a sorta middle ground

[simplysly.livejournal.com]

Harry is a seeker right? We all know this. But this means that he's looking and finding a golden ball about the size of a walnut in a stadium that can hold all of Hogwarts.
Part of this might be from the Dursely's ("BOY! There's a SPECK!"), or he might have just developed it on his own.

In addition to this, Ron is the first person (that we know of) that is his own age that befriends him. Knowing Harry, he would pay attention to anything that might be important to Ron, especially in the beginning, sorta as a way to try and keep his attention. Also, the twins helped him get on the train. Harry isn't used to acts of kindness, really.

Now, in reference to the Slytherin, Harry probably just didn't care. He knew the guy was there, after all, but the name isn't always important. He would probably recognize the Slytherin as such, even if he wasn't in school robes or colors, but there's no real reason for Harry to learn his name. Malfoy is obnoxious, Crabbe and Goyle back him up, and Pansy hangs off his arm. That's basically the only Slytherin's that we've been introduced too. Sure there's Marcus Flint, but that's Quidditich, and doesn't count.

Anyway, I'm aware I'm running off at the mouth again, so I'll just take my leave...

[justinetre.livejournal.com]

You know, that's an excellent point! The books *are* told from Harry's point-of-view, but maybe JKR just does this to keep the attention focused on Harry instead of which twin says what, making it seem significant?