Doctor Who: A Good Man Goes to War

[amanuensis1]

Okay, the teaser for this week's Doctor Who may have been the greatest opening in the history of Who. I say that even remembering the opening to The Big Bang last season. (And yes, I note both are Moffat episodes. My bias shows not at all, I'm sure.) Rory. Rory, Rory, Rory. I was waiting for that without having any idea that I've been waiting for that until I got it. Man, that kind of surprise is the best.

Speaking of which, the BIG REVEAL.

I've seen some discussion that the reveal is less powerful because fandom guessed it, which makes for interesting observation about the effect of fandom on a serialized piece of fiction, one in which we have time for mass speculation. It wasn't so much that fandom guessed it as much as it was in our list of possibilities, and got more and more probable with each new episode this season, which started narrowing things down. River Song's around a lot! And Amy's pregnant-not-pregnant! And there's a little girl! Who's in a spacesuit! That was put there by enemy aliens! Who may have shot the Doctor! Hang on, isn't River in prison for having killed a man? And her timeline's all wonky to ours? And Amy just had a baby girl! So if River had turned out to be something completely unrelated to this storyline, would it have been more or less satisfying? I can't blame Moffat for properly laying down his material so that everything fits. I do think that the swift among us might have seen "Melody Pond" at the very start of this episode and got their confirmation as early as that moment (I am not among the swift, I admit), or put together that River couldn't be there because she had to avoid time paradoxing herself (I'm not that swift either, that just came to me while typing). But those are intraepisode anvils. Which I still didn't see until the time came to see them.

From the first appearance of River we've had speculation on who she is. If she'd turned out to be the Doctor's mother or Romana or Leela or any of the other speculations, would we say that we had guessed it? I suspect we would have, the same way that (Harry Potter semi-spoiler) "Snape was in love with a particular character" was on our list of possibilities even though we had nothing to confirm it until we were told it, and it felt less powerful as a result. We like it when even the hivemind of fandom can't go where the authors are going, don't we, but we don't want things to come at us from so far out of left field that we call it a cheat. Kuroshitsuji II episode 8 is my go-to example of "We've laid the groundwork with this character but haven't given you enough to guess; now here's almost everything in one episode, prepare to gasp" in serialized fiction. I think, with River Song's Big Reveal, I am too pleased that this was no cheat to be disappointed that the answer actually was in the list of guesses. I look how far back the groundwork has been laid and am too impressed to be disappointed.

Other small notes:

-CHAMPION LA LECHE LEAGUE MACHO LACTATING SONTARAN. To the end of my days I will cherish that. It's like the joke about how if men had periods they'd brag about how heavy their flow was.

-Also to be cherished to the end of days: "Whyever do you put up with me?" *thirty-foot lizard tongue sleepy-stinger dart* *shared naughty look* MOFFAT DIDN'T HAVE TO GIVE US THAT NAUGHTY LOOK. HE COULD HAVE PRETENDED THE SEQUENCE OF SPOKEN LINE AND TONGUE HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH EACH OTHER. BUT HE GAVE US THAT LOOK OMIGOD.

-I do want to see the moment when Lorna the soldier meets the Doctor when she's a child. I suspect we'll be given it by season's end.

And so it shouldn't be lost in all this: did anyone else fall out of their chair laughing at the sheer balls of the next episode title? I really can't emphasize SHEER BALLS enough. I mean, you couldn't name a South Park episode that and not call it sheer balls.

Comments

[meredyth-13.livejournal.com]

Sometimes I just fall a little bit more in love with you (in the nice way) - this is one of those times.

And OMG, you saw the LOOK too? I had to explain that sequence to my partner as I was chortling all over. AND the follow up where those two are talking about Lorna and being all 'Oooh, nice, can we keep her' about it.

Lactating Sontarans For.The.Win!

I've twittered at Steve Moffat and told him I'm sending him the bill for cleaning my exploded brain off the living room walls. He is failing to respond. *sigh*

(honestly, fandom - if we're going to be clever and make guesses, then we have to accept that sometimes we're going to be clever in line with the writers and get it right - is that not a reinforcement that the clues were good? and if it was still guesses, that the build up was appropriate? *eye roll*)

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

Moffat is refusing to take responsibility for your living room walls cleaning? A pox on him! Oh, well, I'll forgive him for the LACTATING SONTARAN. That will never stop being wonderful.

I really don't think I caught that the Silurian and her sidekick had A Thing until that look; I think that's why I lost it so hard over that moment.

I can't help but love fandom analysis. This is why movies, seen in-theatre, are best at being twisty; there's no intermission as a rule where everyone gets up and discusses where it's going to go from here; you have to take it all in as one piece. Assuming you're observing the polite rule of not talking during the film, of course. :D

*loves you right back!*

[fyrie.livejournal.com]

I adored the Sontaran :D I love that despite everything, he was *still* so Sontaran in his manner. There should be more Sontarans like him :)

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

Oh, gods, yes. He was beautiful. Healing people while respectfully wishing they could meet on the field of battle one day so that he might smite them. And his whole, "I'm dying gloriously in battle; I'm not enjoying it as much as I imagined" speech, migod. I would marry that Sontaran.

[daigranon.livejournal.com]

RORY.

I was kind of guessing the reveal because there was a spoiler that the baby's name was Melody Pond, but by now we should know that Moffat is like the king of trolls and ANYTHING could happen. So I was still not sure until the very end, and for me, it was still pretty surprising.

Agreed though, Moffat did lay down the facts pretty well.

THE LACTATING SONTARAN, YES THAT WAS FABULOUS. I think the fans really enjoyed the Victorian England bit too ^^

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

I hadn't heard the spoiler! Glad I didn't, though I suspect I would still have been dense and not put it together. It's just vague enough (so I tell myself so as not to think myself a total idiot!).

[sahiya.livejournal.com]

I was disappointed that fandom had sort of taken it as a given. I really wanted to be shocked by whatever it was. I wanted to sit there both shocked and going, "Oh, but of COURSE." Because Moffat is smarter than I am when it comes to this stuff, and this was the BIG FUCKING REVEAL and I actually wanted it to be a reveal. So sue me.

And yes, I actually did have a brief moment of wishing I wasn't involved in fandom, because then I actually would have been shocked. Oh well. I guess this is what happens when you're involving an active fandom as the show is airing.

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

Are you disappointed because fandom took it as a given, or are you disappointed with the show/reveal because fandom had taken it as a given?

[sahiya.livejournal.com]

I'm disappointed Moffat wasn't smarter than we are, I suppose. I love his stuff because he is so clever. The different Doctor in "Time of Angels" last year was different - it wasn't a huge reveal in and of itself, and it was part of a larger arc that still surprised me. But to be told for weeks leading up to the episode "DUDE THIS IS GOING TO BE SO SHOCKING" and then to be . . . not shocked? That's disappointing.

Also, it was not a theory I was fond of, and I was really hoping he'd do something else. Meh.

[mingbutterfly.livejournal.com]

OMFG your icon killed me.

I've never seen Dr. Who... And again, a tingling, unnamed dread besets my blackened soul. Surely, this most unpardonable of fangirlish sins will be my undoing... :(

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

You shall be forgiven! But you might give it a try, particularly starting with the reboot six seasons ago, since that's what seems to have mobilized the fans so. And if you don't like it, well, you gave it a try!

*has more irreverent Kuroshitsuji icons*

[mingbutterfly.livejournal.com]

Oh, it is inevitable I'll watch it. Hitsuzen :)

Yay Kuroshitsuji icons! <3 Life complete now.

[lady_songsmith]

I'm not deep in Who fandom - I don't read the review boards, or the spoiler posts, or the creator interviews, or visit discussion LJs, or any of the common fannish activities. I just watch and squee about it with whatever fannish friends I have who are also into it. So coming from a relative isolation, I thought Moffat telegraphed his reveal way too early and way too hard. I came into the episode firmly expecting to hear that River was Amy's child, and yes, had it confirmed as soon as the kid's name was Melody.

Fandom being good at dragging out all the possibilities via the hivemind is one thing, and I adored it in Potter fandom, but being able to see the end coming in advance without the hivemind is boring. But then, that's been my issue with Moffat since he took the reins, and I just did a big ranty thing about it on my own journal. IDK, I kinda want RTD back.

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

By your definition I'm not "deep in Who fandom" either, and yet I consider myself fairly well into the fandom because I do the same things you do! Definitions. Go figure.

*reads your post* Oh, I think I will comment over there, what you have to say is interesting!

[lady_songsmith]

Part of it may be the type of squee? Ours tends to be more of the OMG TONGUE! LOL! type than the speculation type.

Glad you think it's interesting; it was pretty stream-of-consciousness and I wasn't sure how much sense it would make to anyone but me. :)

[sahiya.livejournal.com]

I thought Moffat telegraphed his reveal way too early and way too hard.

Yes, this. If fandom was able to come up with it and decide that it was 90% likely to happen, that I would argue that this is almost certainly true.

Though I never, ever want RTD back. Moffat on a bad day is still better than RTD on his best, as far as I'm concerned.

[lady_songsmith]

Though I never, ever want RTD back. Moffat on a bad day is still better than RTD on his best, as far as I'm concerned.

do you think so? I thought we got far more interesting episodes in the first 4 than the last two.

[sahiya.livejournal.com]

I . . . rarely rewatch anything from RTD's run, whereas I rewatch Moffat's episodes (both from the first four seasons and from the last two) endlessly. They're much smarter. And I find Moffat to be a much, well, a much kinder show runner. I was always worried RTD was going to hurt us, because he had so many times. He did terrible things to his characters and never dealt with the consequences. Moffat, because he thinks of the show as a children's show, is far more concerned about his viewers' well-being. He wants to scare the pants off of us, but he doesn't want to actually traumatize us. I also hate RTD's writing with a passion.

But obviously YMMV.

[lady_songsmith]

Huh. I think you may have just put your finger on one of the things that bothers me about the difference between them -- he thinks of the show as a children's show. He does, doesn't he? That explains rather a lot about the way it's been shaping up the last couple of seasons. And possibly why I have enjoyed it less; I fell in love with the grown-ups Who.

[sahiya.livejournal.com]

Ah see, as someone who loves children's literature (and thinks it's just as valid as literature as adult literature), I think it's wonderful. And historically, DW was a children's show, which is part of why Moffat's Who feels a lot more true to the original than RTD's does.

[lady_songsmith]

I enjoy a great deal of children's literature, but I never watched original Who, so it was the new series that hooked me. I'm not sure if I would have gotten hooked on original Who or not. *shrug*

[sahiya.livejournal.com]

I came at it through New Who, as well, but made a bit of a project of watching Classic Who last summer when I was bored (a lot of it is available streaming on Netflix). There are episodes of the original that are very watchable. But there is also a lot of stuff that isn't (and sadly Seven, who is one of my favorites, got really bizarre writing). It's sort of worth a looksee just to get the in-jokes, which are plentiful in Moffat's Who, and to see where it all came from.

[neocloud9.livejournal.com]

"Whyever do you put up with me?" *thirty-foot lizard tongue sleepy-stinger dart* *shared naughty look*

I'M GLAD YOU CAUGHT THAT TOO. 8D

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

I AM SO GLAD I CAUGHT IT.

[jamoche]

Something that didn't hit me till much later: In the first episode River says something about wars being fought over even the least bit of Time Lord DNA.

Well, she would know!

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

I know there could be so many things that I would catch if I would let myself go back and watch all the River Song episodes--well, in particular, every episode since River Song showed up. I want to make the time!

[ariadneelda.livejournal.com]

I hadn't been watching this season closely, nor following any DW communities or reading any discussions and theories or thinking about clues at all, so I never guessed the reveal, not until it was spelled out for me! Makes feel kind of dumb that fandom had guessed already, even early on, but OTOH I'm glad I got to experience the shock and be all "Wow!" I remember how I found many parts of DH predictable just because fandom had guessed them, and how I almost wished I hadn't been in fandom (okay, not really!) just so I could have been shocked.

Loved nurse!Sontaran - and I totally noticed THAT LOOK! :D

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

I haven't been doing much of that either, except for the few people on my flist who do talk about it, but that's been enough to make the speculations abound. I'm actually THRILLED for you, getting to come to it fairly cold!

I have always said that as much as I was disappointed with DH, I was thrilled that the seed that JKR had planted with Voldemort using Harry in his resurrection ritual and Dumbledore's brief triumphant look never did get unrooted by fandom completely. I have always bowed down to her for that!

[kita0610.livejournal.com]

I think the BALLS of the ep name expands geometrically considering it followed an emotionally draining episode- so that when we are all sitting there going NOOOO BABBBBYYY! And YAY RIIIIIVER!! and OMG PONDS!! and not knowing if we should squee, cry or throw up- suddenly HITLER.

Oh, Moffat. <3

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

YES. It's like, the mention of Hitler in that context is so irreverent it's hysterical; it has such potential to offend EVERYTHING, oh my god, I can't believe he did that. It's like it's a joke. Like Mel Brooks doing a fake trailer for "Jews on Ice" in History of the World.

[kita0610.livejournal.com]

THIS, yes!

I'm Jewish, and all I could think of when I saw that was "it's Spring time ... for Hitler...in Gerrrrmaaaaany."

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

*has utter laughing fit* EXACTLY.

[midnitemaraud-r.livejournal.com]

I loved the ep, too! And RORY!!!! So awesome!! I'd guessed that River could be Amy and Rory's daughter, but I couldn't decide if it was going to be a red herring or not. I thought it was well played, despite the fact that I'd guessed. The thing is, though, a lot of people actually were surprised. My niece and nephew called me this morning after watching it completely shocked. And a friend on my flist also posted that they totally didn't see that coming.

When the Doctor Who will return in September in "Let's Kill Hitler" popped up, I admit, I was like, WHAT? REALLY STEVEN? You're really going with THAT title??

And then I wondered if we were going back to Churchill and WWII again. But then I thought about it, and I think it's not literally about Hitler, but more the idea - going back to Genesis of the Daleks and Tom Baker's dilemma as well as the usual morality play question - if you knew someone was going to grow up to do despicably evil things (like Hitler), if you could, would you go back in time and kill them? That's what I think the title represents.

Gah! I don't want to wait until September! But Torchwood is coming soon! \o/

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

I finally saw a preview for Torchwood's new season and I've got to admit, it looks pretty dynamite. Great concept, certainly!

[salomesensei.livejournal.com]

Wait wha? I thought Torchwood was done!

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

I think it premiered this weekend; I'm about to go check!

[quigonejinn.livejournal.com]

CHAMPION LA LECHE LEAGUE MACHO LACTATING SONTARAN

Lost my shit at the line in the episode, lost my shit all over again reading that. omfg.

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

IT IS A "LOSE YOUR SHIT" KIND OF LINE.

[salomesensei.livejournal.com]

What a glorious episode review! Believe it or not, I didn't see it until just last night! I was all 'gasmy over the TARDIS-wifey episode and then all bleh over the flesh two-parter and then forgot to watch the episode I had on DVR and then hubby didn't want to watch it the other night and finally yesterday afternoon while the offspring was at a friend's playing D&D (cuz we're nerdy like that) ... I saw it!

YES to the Sontaran lactating nurse.
YES to the tall/short/fat/thin gay duo.
YES to the lizard and her little maidy lovergirl with swords and tongue
HMM to the headless monks that felt way Douglas Adamsy
And...well...kinda BUH to the River Song being Amy's baby. I didn't groove on it, or on the Doctor getting all turned on by knowing he boinked Amy's daughter. I dunno. I may be sold on it in future, but right now, it's lowered my River Song adoration considerably.

So cool that you're so into this. Do you love Sherlock too, one hopes?

[amanuensis1.livejournal.com]

I LOVE Sherlock. I'll so be looking forward to more of it! I love the way they've preserved the dynamics of the two and let Watson be suitably badass!

This was a heck of a season-hiatus-y moment upon which to pause. (Oh! As soon as they tried to make excuses about the Headless Monks I was freaking out. "YOUR THEORIES ARE TOO GENTLE TO BE LIKELY.")

[salomesensei.livejournal.com]

I just rewatched Study in Pink from DVR (PBS was rerunning it). It holds up to a second viewing deliciously. The bromance is delicious, as is the fact that the writer/producer team intends it that way. Wish I liked the second episode as well, but I found it muddled. The updating of the Tong stuff just didn't work for me. Third ep, of course, brings on more badass fun.

I do wish I liked the turn of events in the last DW episode. I confess I really don't. But perhaps they'll make me like it later. ^_^

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