My last (maybe) Half-Blood Prince meta.

[amanuensis1]

We're nearing the end of the time I can meta on this: I've said (oh, how I've said) that Snape's loyalty to Dumbledore isn't remotely in question because of the structure of Book 6 and the series as a whole, and that I dislike how Harry's been left in the dark at the end of Book 6, since it's unfair to make the answers plain to the reader but leave the protagonist unenlightened at the conclusion of a volume. (To clarify, this does not mean that Harry is stupid not to have seen it--Harry didn't get to read the Spinner's End chapter.) But here's another way that cheats us: do you realize, if Snape's motives had been revealed to Harry--if Snape or a glimpse into Dumbledore's pensieve or his will or what have you had communicated this to Harry at the end of Book 6, and Harry as well as the reader saw that Snape had gone into deep cover at Dumbledore's command--does everyone realize that that ending would actually have made Snape's ultimate loyalties ambiguous? That the "is Snape good or is Snape evil?" stickers and debates and contests would actually have had meat, if that had occurred?

Seriously, a third of us would be saying, "Snape killed Dumbledore at Dumbledore's command; we now know that the last book will be about Harry and Snape being on the same side, and if they will triumph over Voldemort and live." Another third would say, "Snape's pulled the wool over everyone's eyes--Dumbledore thought Snape was reluctant to kill him, but in reality Snape's been on Voldemort's side all the time, and just wait until Harry confronts Voldemort expecting Snape to have his back and Snape starts to laugh, 'What, you didn't believe that claptrap I told you, Potter? I've never been so delighted to cast a spell in my life as the day I killed that Slytherin-hating old fool.' It'll be amazing!" And the last third would still be insisting, "Snape is his own man, and his actions at the end will do what is best for Snape."

Another reason to resent the ending of Half-Blood Prince. I would have loved seeing all the sides of that debate.

Comments

[marginaliana]

I'm always so amazed when I come across entries that articulate exactly what I think in a much more succinct and elegant way than I ever could have. Consider me amazed! You've put your finger on exactly what I am frustrated about wrt both book 6 and the endless Snape debate. It seems so very obvious to me how that plot point is going to turn out that the debate leaves me tearing my hair out both at the readers who can't see it and at JKR for not being as subtle as she could have been. That said, given that there are so many readers who can't see it, I suspect that your and my idea of subtle would have whooshed over the heads of too many.

oh, someone else thinks it's obvious

[http://users.livejournal.com/_inbetween_/]

The problem with your suggestion is that it's intelligent thinking a double-bluff, while most readers still fall for the single bluff.

[berseker.livejournal.com]

I don´t know... my problem is that, for some reason, I don´t have much faith in JKR. I could see her making Snape evil and ruining her own story (no, it´s not as crazy as it sounds, she did some stupid moves along the series).

So, when I think about the logic of the story, I expect Snape to be redeemed. But I keep thinking that everything is possible, because she hasn´t proved herself to me yet and I´m an arrogant bitch, yes, why?

[melusinahp.livejournal.com]

I agree with what you said about that making the ending more interesting and ambiguous, but it would also be impossible.

The whole plan -- Harry witnessing Snape murdering Dumbledore -- was necessary so that when Voldemort reads Harry's mind, as he will, there will be no doubt whatsoever in Harry's mind as to Snape's loyalties. If Voldemort used Legilimency on Harry and discovered the tiniest doubt that Snape was loyal to Voldemort all Hell would break loose and Snape would be instantly killed.

Harry had to be completely convinced of Snape's false badness. That's what Snape and Dumbledore had been working on since Harry arrived at Hogwarts.

[twigged.livejournal.com]

Interesting! And you're right, of course. I rather would have liked to see that second option play out.

[lady_songsmith]

We're going to have to disagree on this one -- I'm with berseker in my lack of faith in JKR. (I've been saying for ages that I want one of those "I trust Snape" icons with a second frame: JKR and the text "It's HER I don't trust!" Shame I'm too lazy to make one. :P) While I believe it's barely possible that Snape will turn out to be on his own side, I just don't think that Rowling has the craft skill to redeem him.

Is he redeemable? Yes, absolutely, and there's lovely fanfic to that end. Can JKR write it? I don't think so. She's an excellent world-builder, and she tells a good story, but she handles her characters very clumsily. She has yet to really move beyond the archetypes into true three-dimensional characters, and her attempts to do so have been rather poorly handled - thus giving us CAPSLOCK!Harry and Grey!Tonks and Surprise!Ginny.

This actually makes Good!Snape my worst nightmare for Deathly Hallows. If she tries to redeem him, I fully expect it to be another sudden revealation, probably in an action scene where, like Sirius in the DOM, you'll miss it if you blink.

Snape as morally ambiguous? Certainly. And actually I think I'd prefer Snape-for-Snape, were I directing the plot. It's very Slytherin. But Rowling hasn't handled ambiguity well in the past. She certainly seems to want to type all characters and innately "good" or "bad", even after all that nattering about "choices not birth" -- Riddle's backstory was the nail in that coffin, for me. We set up this huge parallel between Harry and Tom, with Dumbledore preaching the virtues of choice, and then when we see Young Tom? He's from a family that's nasty and twisted on both sides, and he's nasty himself from an extremely young age. Where's the choice in that?

And all the lovely ambiguity that we read into the last 6 books, HBP especially? I'm afraid I'm cynical enough to believe that it stems solely from Rowling not having decided yet whose side Snape is on. I can very much see her deciding that during the writing of Hallows, and then we'll either get "Of Course The Greasy Bastard Is Evil; Ugly is Always Evil and Vice-Versa" or we'll get "Snape Stabs Malfoy in the Back at a Crucial Moment and Announces He Loves Kittens and Rainbows." Either would be highly disappointing, but I'm bracing myself because I can't see it going any other way.

[ausmac.livejournal.com]

I'd love to the know the truth-not necessarily about Snape, but whether JK did indeed know the story from beginning to end. I don't know that I believe its possible to know every detail of a 7 book series from the moment you start writing book one. I'm not even sure I believe she originally intended to write 7 books. Did JK know that what started as a fairly light story with book 1 would end up a very dark story by book 7? Did she intend that Harry would be as wounded, both in body and mind, as he has been?

And I like to think that she never revealed the truth in regard to Snape, not necessarily to be secretive as part of the story, but because to do so would be to tie herself to a particular outcome - and I think she wanted to leave herself room to write with the last book. How Snape's and Voldemort's and Harry's story resolved would then be more fluid. Since she would be tying up all the storylines in the ultimate novel, by leaving certain things untold she would have room to manouver.

[gmth.livejournal.com]

The debate seems to have worked among the books' real target audience, though. I've discussed the books with several kids and teens and as far as they were concerned the question of Snape's loyalties is way up in the air. I think as adults who are more familiar with the tropes, we're interrogating the text from the wrong (or right, I suppose) perspective.

[woman-ironing.livejournal.com]

Here from the Snitch, but, er, I'm completely lost!

[ruthannereid.livejournal.com]

*giggling* I really won't be shocked no matter what Rowling does at this point. Also, I adore the Scoobydo/Snape icon. XD I will continue to love Snape, because no matter WHAT else he is, he's brilliant and twisted and severely effed up.

....there has got to be something wrong with me. XD

[berseker.livejournal.com]

This will look off-topic.

Well, it IS a little off-topic, but this thing reminds me of you and, hell, mine was "Severus Snape turns Hogwarts into a gingerbread castle with the Philosopher's Stone".

So check it out: http://www.masquerademaskarts.com/memes/harrypotterspoiler.php